Darkness Falls

[GM Franchise]

How can you guess he was a Church member when someone already outed that information already?

That said I'm leaning toward voting Justin. He's actively inactive so Im suspect of that to be honest.

[GM Franchise]

I'm drunk at a nightclub but I stand by my last post. The Bennett target doesn't make sense but the info about the silver bullet is extremely relevant.

[GM Oldfield]

Wait Justin is in this game?

But yeah, I probably should have guessed Bennett night 2 not last night.

[GM Josh]

How can you guess he was a Church member when someone already outed that information already?

That said I'm leaning toward voting Justin. He's actively inactive so Im suspect of that to be honest.

I would say it was logic and really using the wording of his role to his advantage. He said he needs to get it right twice to get a night kill so smart call would be "guessing" someone who was outed.

That being said, I don't know if I fully trust it. The silver bullet comment is an easy thing to fake and say since Ed said it too, but also makes me think it may be a slip and Oldfield was turned by Ed before he died.

[GM Oldfield]

How can you guess he was a Church member when someone already outed that information already?
.

I don't know what you mean by that? My sole role is to assign roles at night and be rewarded for it. Whether his role has been confirmed in the day is irrelevant to my job.

[GM Kirk]

I really think Doug has made up this ability of his to cover for being recruited the same night Bennett couldn't get him. I believe he knows who targets him, but I don't think he avoids the actions.

[GM Oldfield]

I completely missed Ed even mentioning a silver bullet.

[GM Eli]

Oldfield, what made you guess that someone was a Zombie on night 1 when there had been no discussion of what groups/factions/whatever there are that exist in this game until the second day phase?

[GM Oldfield]

It's a wild guess and I didn't think I could guess human/survivor at the time. Plus something that was written in my bio.

[GM Justin]

I am here. A combination of busy and the previous day phase moving fast I wasn't able to post.

I've gone back and read most of the game to now. I think Kirk is onto something about Ed recruiting Doug and he recruiting Fosters. On my phone currently, will post my support in more detail when I'm back at my computer working

[GM Pancho]

Much like we caught Ed in a lie and rightfully lynched him I am remise to say we have another lie situation that needs to be settled.

All this information coming out about Douglas means I have to revise the credit I had been giving him and may need to reanalyze how I've been approaching Bennett.

Bennett has stated that he cannot recruit - "The Holy Church is the Holy Church that just keeps people safe nothing more, nothing less. And for the record, I can't even communicate with anyone other than myself and who I tell the mod I want to try and save for the night." aka not a faction but a singular member

Doug has stated that "Both tried to recruit me last night. Both failed...it had to do with my passive ability which I'm not revealing but many of you should understand (my assumption is some of you survivors also have an ability take Fosters for example)"

We have a classic case of I cannot recruit v They tried to recruit me.

This is where our attention needs to be and I have been on Bennett - but right now Douglas needs to be explaining himself.

[GM Bennett]

As I have stated before, I have nothing to lie about and have been nothing but forthcoming with the information that I have and can give. I will note that the people that I save will know that the Church helped them if I were successful in doing so. As I have said I cannot communicate with anyone that I save, as you have detected Pancho, I am in fact on my own during this fight against the supernaturals. Just as I've giving you an example of who my character is similar to in terms of Van Helsing but of the cloth.

I want to see what Justin has to say and what he think since we haven't really heard from him during the game. I'm also curious as to what Doug may have to say.

If what Oldfield is saying is the truth then I'm curious as to why I was prevented from saving Fosters? And who prevented Fosters from his own investigation?

[GM Oldfield]

But fosters isn't dead. So you didn't fail either?

[GM Fosters]

I'm still a survivor, so I'm grateful to whoever it is that protected me from being turned to a zombie or whatever.

If they could continue to protect me so I can continue to out the zombies or werewolves or whatever that would be great.

[GM Bennett]

But fosters isn't dead. So you didn't fail either?

Yes that is a positive outlook on it indeed.

[GM Dougie]

I can explain I just need the time to write a post and I don't have it right now

@fosters I protected you. Unfortunately it blocks you also. Think of it as a jailkeep. Figured you'd be a target for recruitment if not already

[GM Kirk]

A passive ability to know what factions try to recruit you whilst blocking the recruitment and an active ability that protects others from recruitment? Sounds OP.

My vote's on Doug or Bennett depending on how Doug explains himself.

[GM Dougie]

Alright. First I'm going to go back to something I brought up days ago...the survivor win con: win if you're alive at the end...so at first, I assumed this was standard win con just like I posted about from mafiascum. We know anything can go in this game but I am a player who plays the game my way and that is to operate under an assumed set of conditions. Whether right or wrong, I can't play unless I believe something is set a certain way. Kind of like reads right?

Anyway. Enter night 1:

I absolutely told the truth about being targeted by both factions. Once I saw you all were targeting Bennett, I said what I said intentionally in order to get heat off of him. I'll explain that now.

I am not immune to recruitment. That was my lie. Actually...I was recruited by both in an order. First I became a zombie, then I joined the holy church. The worst part is that once you're recruited, you have no idea who recruited you. You only know you're now in the faction. In other words, I only know about Bennett being in the holy church from the game thread and not anything told to me privately. I have no communication with anyone at night. That is the truth. My actual ability did not change which is essentially a jailkeeping ability. I block their ability but I also protect them from having something negative happen.

Night 1 I targeted Ed. As it turned out he was patient zero so perhaps my ability does not work on the recruiter (I'm operating under the assumption that patient zero would be the one recruiting zombies). Night 2 I used it on Pancho (the item I received is useless for me). Last night I picked Fosters. Although there's a negative utility to my role, Pancho and Fosters both made sense as recruits with Pancho being an excellent player and Fosters outing a cop-like role.

The other insight I have that no one else has is that I know both the zombie and holy church win-cons because I was in both factions. Without directly quoting the mod; Zombies only win once everyone is a zombie. That is 100% truth. Anyone who is currently a survivor cannot win with the zombies under that win condition.

Once I was converted to the church, new win con. Again, without directly quoting the mod; Holy Church wins after threats to mankind are gone.

Now that you have everything I know, here's why I did what I did. It is my opinion that survivors can win with the church. My assumption (your decision to side with me or not) is that survivors aren't threats to mankind. Since Bennett was outed in the thread, I did what I had to do to try and keep him from being lynched.

----

To summarize, yes I lied about some of the things I said. Some are true. It is up to you to believe what you want. I am in the church. It is my opinion based on my win con that survivors can win with the church. That is what I played how I played.

Pretty much everything of mine is on the table. If you want to vote me I accept that. If you want to ask me any questions, criticize anything I said, or want me to elaborate on anything further, I am more than willing.

[GM Eli]

Okay, so having read what Doug just said, I have some thoughts. If Ed being patient zero recruited Doug on night one, he was lynched on day 2 so theoretically there should be no more zombies (this is assuming that the Zombie faction only had one player to begin with) unless Doug is still considered one? Which if he is being fully honest about being recruited by Bennett, then that would seem be likely as otherwise he would have conflicting win conditions.

The problem I see with this if Doug is telling the truth is that Bennett lied about his ability to recruit.

The other problem I see is that this would indicate there are more than just the church faction, zombie faction and the survivors. There would have to be another group that is considered to be a threat to humanity, right?

[GM Pancho]

Alright. First I'm going to go back to something I brought up days ago...the survivor win con: win if you're alive at the end...so at first, I assumed this was standard win con just like I posted about from mafiascum. We know anything can go in this game but I am a player who plays the game my way and that is to operate under an assumed set of conditions. Whether right or wrong, I can't play unless I believe something is set a certain way. Kind of like reads right?

Anyway. Enter night 1:

I absolutely told the truth about being targeted by both factions. Once I saw you all were targeting Bennett, I said what I said intentionally in order to get heat off of him. I'll explain that now.

I am not immune to recruitment. That was my lie. Actually...I was recruited by both in an order. First I became a zombie, then I joined the holy church. The worst part is that once you're recruited, you have no idea who recruited you. You only know you're now in the faction. In other words, I only know about Bennett being in the holy church from the game thread and not anything told to me privately. I have no communication with anyone at night. That is the truth. My actual ability did not change which is essentially a jailkeeping ability. I block their ability but I also protect them from having something negative happen.

Night 1 I targeted Ed. As it turned out he was patient zero so perhaps my ability does not work on the recruiter (I'm operating under the assumption that patient zero would be the one recruiting zombies). Night 2 I used it on Pancho (the item I received is useless for me). Last night I picked Fosters. Although there's a negative utility to my role, Pancho and Fosters both made sense as recruits with Pancho being an excellent player and Fosters outing a cop-like role.

The other insight I have that no one else has is that I know both the zombie and holy church win-cons because I was in both factions. Without directly quoting the mod; Zombies only win once everyone is a zombie. That is 100% truth. Anyone who is currently a survivor cannot win with the zombies under that win condition.

Once I was converted to the church, new win con. Again, without directly quoting the mod; Holy Church wins after threats to mankind are gone.

Now that you have everything I know, here's why I did what I did. It is my opinion that survivors can win with the church. My assumption (your decision to side with me or not) is that survivors aren't threats to mankind. Since Bennett was outed in the thread, I did what I had to do to try and keep him from being lynched.

----

To summarize, yes I lied about some of the things I said. Some are true. It is up to you to believe what you want. I am in the church. It is my opinion based on my win con that survivors can win with the church. That is what I played how I played.

Pretty much everything of mine is on the table. If you want to vote me I accept that. If you want to ask me any questions, criticize anything I said, or want me to elaborate on anything further, I am more than willing.

By definition you are both a Zombie and a Holy Church Member ... which flavor wise both you and Bennett are having us believe that the two CANNOT co exist.  You want to paint the "factions" as now "neighborhoods" instead of ACTUALLY changing your alignment. 

Something that has been bothering me as well when we did not get a lynch on Bennett - look at when the day was called and look back at what time the day should have been called.  They don't match up.  Much like the news headline we got on Day 3 and continued on Day 4 but not on Day 2.

The Holy Church has WAY more power than they are letting on and I wouldn't believe anything EITHER Doug or Bennett say.

SIMPLE FACTS.  BENNETT SAID HE CANNOT RECRUIT - DOUG SAID HE WAS RECRUITED NIGHT ONE AFTER SAYING HE COULD NOT BE A RECRUIT. 

Time for yall to stop believing eithers changing story.  Wish we could lynch two of them at the same time.  My instinct is to say Bennett is the ring leader so he goes first but Douglas got a power from me that he still is not open about.  We've seen that power be a syringe [probably more Bennett lies] and a Silver Bullet [according to Oldfield].  Considering Bennett has both a power from me and was the ringleader I am going to stick to that.

Vote: Bennett

His lynch was stopped for a reason.

[GM Dougie]

By definition you are both a Zombie and a Holy Church Member

Before I even read the rest of your post. This is wrong. I specifically know I was cured of being a zombie specifically from the mod. I am not in multiple factions. Nor do I actually really know how the recruitment works. I was a survivor. Then I became a zombie. Now I'm in the church. I am NOT in multiple factions.

Now I'll read the rest of your post.

[GM Dougie]

but Douglas got a power from me that he still is not open about. 

Ok the next thing you said is that I got a power from you. False. I got an item. You used the term item yesterday why not today? I said it was useless. Its supposed to prevent me from being recruited to the church...which doesn't matter to me since I'm already in it.

I have a bribery role.  I'm a survivor that wants to stay alive so bad I give out items to people who visit me so I can survive.

What I received is in line with what you already claim to give...

[GM Pancho]

I'll eat it for using the phrase power role - as the item grants a person the power to do something as discussed so far.  But ultimately an argument of semantics and not substance.

[GM Bennett]

You're misinformed, Pancho. Doug told the truth about the win con which I have already said. I am only here to help humanity and eliminate all threats to it.

I am not lying about the item given to me and I find it strange that you are trying to call me a liar when I have done nothing of the sort.

I told you once I have saved someone, they will know that they have been saved by the church other than that I have no idea other than my teachings of how to fight supernaturals will be passed onto them via my untimely death.

You're also too hung up on the headlines...The mod controls the fucking game and does the headlines himself I do not have any say on that whatsoever so this accusation is becoming annoying and off-putting. Damn near taking the fun of the game in terms of the headlines. They're there for us for the fun of the game as well as giving everyone playing clues, makes no sense to keep trying to say a player has control of that.

Also Drew, if Ed's ability was similar to mine the person in order (1st, 2nd, 3rd etc) who he has bitten and infected already would now be the new leader of that Zombie faction. Just cause we have found and lynched patient one does that mean that the threat to humanity has been stopped completely. If he was able to turn someone prior to being found out it then the threat is still out there.

I'll have to do some back reading to see if I notice anything different but that is something I would say be mindful of going forward in terms of threats to humanity.

[GM Dougie]

An argument of mischaracterization.

Listen I won't argue anymore. I've said my peace. I'll answer constructive questions and I doubt you specifically will trust me since I've clearly associated myself with Bennett with my post.

Like Kirk sort of alluded to, I made up the "can't be recruited thing". But I am NOT and I repeat...NOT in both zombie and holy church. Only in the church.

There are four scenarios in play here:

1) There's another zombie out there still as Ed could have infected someone night 2.

2) There's an additional faction out there besides Zombies and the church.

3) I am wrong and survivors only win if ALL factions are gone.

4) Any combination of the 3 above.

[GM Bennett]

Also how the hell can I lie about having an item when you yourself said I outed your ability of giving items to people that target you? Make that make sense?

[GM Eli]

Bennett you told us you don't have the ability to recruit? Are you admitting you lied about that now?

[GM Eli]

Also, I was mistaken about the day Ed was lynched. It was day 3 not 2 so yeah it's entirely possible there's still someone out there who is a zombie even if Doug is telling the truth and he's not both zombie and church.

[GM Bennett]

It wasn't worded as such in my write up. So I don't know how to answer that.

Also from backbreaking the only difference from the stsrt of the game and now Powers hasn't said a word since Day 2 after Pancho questioned him

[GM Pancho]

You're misinformed, Pancho. Doug told the truth about the win con which I have already said. I am only here to help humanity and eliminate all threats to it.

Look whose backing each other now. *GASP*

I am not lying about the item given to me and I find it strange that you are trying to call me a liar when I have done nothing of the sort.

Fine if it makes you feel better you are not a PROVEN liar but I really do not trust y'all or this Holy Church at the moment.

I told you once I have saved someone, they will know that they have been saved by the church other than that I have no idea other than my teachings of how to fight supernaturals will be passed onto them via my untimely death.

So this is the part where the misrepresentation begins.  It sounds like you "saving" people is another euphemism for recruiting.  But you have been presenting it as Helping them live.  Like a doctor role. One's flavor and the other a game mechanic.  This is what I meant when I referenced that either you or Douglas have been lying because since Doug was targeted Night 1 - you had to be the only Holy Church member.  With Douglas admitting he is the second member of the Church.

You're also too hung up on the headlines...The mod controls the fucking game and does the headlines himself I do not have any say on that whatsoever so this accusation is becoming annoying and off-putting. Damn near taking the fun of the game in terms of the headlines. They're there for us for the fun of the game as well as giving everyone playing clues, makes no sense to keep trying to say a player has control of that.

I think the headlines and deadlines actually go together. Allow me to explain my theory.

It is Day 2. With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is at 11:00pm CST on Wednesday, March 9th.

Vote Count
Bennett - 2 (Fosters, Pancho)

Not Voting: Eli, Doug, Ed, Powers, Bennett, Oldfield, Franchise, Kirk, Justin, Josh

Day should have ended at 11pm CST - which would be 9pm PST for me.

Vote Count
Bennett - 6 (Fosters, Pancho, Josh, Kirk, Ed, Oldfield)
Ed - 1 (Franchise)

Not Voting: Eli, Doug, Powers, Bennett, Justin

It is now Night 2. Please submit any night actions you might have promptly. Deadline is at 5:00pm CST on Friday, March 11th.

If you have an active ability and do not wish to use it, please let me know right away.

This post ending day 2 was posted at 2:56 PM PST - a full SIX HOURS BEFORE THE DAY SHOULD ACTUALLY HAVE ENDED and thus you not getting lynched by 1 vote.  I'm working on a theory that the Church powers grow as its members do.  Day 2 opened with just a blurb and no news headline.  Now Day 3 and Day 4 have.  That is not by coincidence.  Day 2 ending 6 hours early was also no coincidence.  In a mafia game when too many "coincidences" start adding up it's because they aren't.

[GM Bennett]

I am not the mod....my name is not Tritch and I don't handle a character named Rex Evans....I don't have anything to do with that shit.

[GM Franchise]

Pancho, did anything happen to you last night?

Interesting you say this because I was trying to save Pancho last night and was unsuccessful but was given an item instead that assists in my duties of saving humanity.

Interesting because Ed visited Pancho last night so something clearly is going on there and my hunch about Ed is likely correct going by the information that you shared.

Ed targeted Pancho the night before he was lynched. Pancho, are you a zombie and is that the real reason that you're going do hard at Bennett right now?

Bennett, you're lying about the recruiting. What's piqued my interest is what else are you hiding.

[GM Kirk]

I agree that there has been too much dishonesty from church members to let them live but I think Doug needs to go first. We need to know if he is still a zombie or not because he apparently targeted Fosters and Bennett. If Doug is still a zombie, then maybe he turned them while he blocked them.

Vote: Doug

[GM Bennett]

Pancho, did anything happen to you last night?

Interesting you say this because I was trying to save Pancho last night and was unsuccessful but was given an item instead that assists in my duties of saving humanity.

Interesting because Ed visited Pancho last night so something clearly is going on there and my hunch about Ed is likely correct going by the information that you shared.

Ed targeted Pancho the night before he was lynched. Pancho, are you a zombie and is that the real reason that you're going do hard at Bennett right now?

Bennett, you're lying about the recruiting. What's piqued my interest is what else are you hiding.

Not hiding anything at all. I'm also wondering if the person Ed infect was Pancho but him saying he targeted him a previous day and was unsuccessful makes me not think it. From what we've seen Ed hasn't told the truth so I really don't know.

[GM Bennett]

Vote: Pancho

[GM Evans]

It is Day 4. With 11 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is at 8:30pm CST on Tuesday, March 15th.

Vote Count
Bennett - 1 (Pancho)
Doug - 1 (Kirk)
Pancho - 1 (Bennett)

Not Voting: Eli, Doug, Powers, Fosters, Oldfield, Franchise, Justin, Josh






In addition, I feel it prudent to note that ending the day early was my fuck up. I wanted not to mention it so as to not disrupt gameplay, I simply applied something to make up for it behind the scenes. Apologies, I saw no other way to backtrack that was fair to all parties. Please carry on the game and don't dwell on this, we can discuss it in the fallout.

[GM Josh]

vote: Bennett

Feelings haven't changed that if you're not a survivor you're not one of us. If we take Bennett out first that stops him from recruiting.

Do find it a bit odd that someone can be recruited by both factions and would get told both win cons if they were recruited in the same night.

[GM Bennett]

vote: Bennett

Feelings haven't changed that if you're not a survivor you're not one of us. If we take Bennett out first that stops him from recruiting.

Do find it a bit odd that someone can be recruited by both factions and would get told both win cons if they were recruited in the same night.

If what the item says true that I got from Pancho it would seem I too can be turned if I don't use the syringe on myself so it does sorta track.



Oh look I'm not the mod and have no influence on what the mod does confirmed ain't that something

[GM Kirk]

That's what I'm not buying about Doug. If he wasn't still a zombie, why would he have been told anything about them? If it was two seperate nights, sure, but he was never really a zombie if he was cured by Bennett recruiting him. I thought Bennett could only save humans, but Doug wasn't human when Bennett got to him, unless the church got Doug first and the zombies second. Doug is a zombie.

[GM Franchise]

Vote: Doug

He's still a zombie. That's the bottom line and reason enough to place a vote. Bennet is a threat yes but I feel Doug is the bigger threat.

[GM Bennett]

That's what I'm not buying about Doug. If he wasn't still a zombie, why would he have been told anything about them? If it was two seperate nights, sure, but he was never really a zombie if he was cured by Bennett recruiting him. I thought Bennett could only save humans, but Doug wasn't human when Bennett got to him, unless the church got Doug first and the zombies second. Doug is a zombie.

He said zombies first then I did in that order if iirc. From what I know my only purpose on this game is to help protect humanity.

[GM Kirk]

For the record, I don't have the ability to kill anyone. I can only save people who are human at night.

If my theory is correct, if I'm unable to to save someone it's either I was blocked from doing so or the person I tried to help isn't human. It's one or the other.

By your own words, it's not possible that he was recruited by the zombies and then "saved" by you. Why are you so keen to back Doug up when his information doesn't match your own?

[GM Oldfield]

That's a lot of information, but there's a lot of previous claims that are now being proven as untrue, and at the end of the day I simply don't trust this church, I don't think their concept of 'saving humanity' is good for us, and I don't envision a scenario where both survivors and the church win.

Vote Bennett

[GM Dougie]

Again, without quoting the mod...

I was turned into a zombie. Then I got cured and joined the church.

Bennett needs to just flat out say recruit and stop with the saving people bit. That's the recruitment. Once you save them they're a part of the church.

He turned me from a zombie to the church and I feel that the church can win with the survivors.

I don't think I can say anymore without repeating myself.

[GM Dougie]

The difference between Bennett and I is that he keeps talking in flavor and I'm flat out saying what's happening.

[GM Franchise]

The question now are the supernatural and zombies a bigger threat than the Church is? That's the deciding point about this in my opinion.

[GM Eli]

My opinion is that no, the church is not more dangerous than the zombies/supernaturals.

The question really now is if Doug/Bennett are actually the church, or if Doug turned Bennett after becoming a zombie himself and they're using this to hide behind. But Bennett put that possibility out there himself, that he could be turned if he didn't use the syringe or whatever on himself.

There's a lot to consider. I just don't know that after all the lying I can trust either of them to be telling the truth now.

[GM Bennett]

I'll continue to talk how ever I want and not give a shit about how any of you feel about it lol

[GM Bennett]

My opinion is that no, the church is not more dangerous than the zombies/supernaturals.

The question really now is if Doug/Bennett are actually the church, or if Doug turned Bennett after becoming a zombie himself and they're using this to hide behind. But Bennett put that possibility out there himself, that he could be turned if he didn't use the syringe or whatever on himself.

There's a lot to consider. I just don't know that after all the lying I can trust either of them to be telling the truth now.

My character is the current leader of the church as I previously said so this would impossible. But with the language of what was said when I got the item it would seem as if it's a possibility

[GM Bennett]

For the record, I don't have the ability to kill anyone. I can only save people who are human at night.

If my theory is correct, if I'm unable to to save someone it's either I was blocked from doing so or the person I tried to help isn't human. It's one or the other.

By your own words, it's not possible that he was recruited by the zombies and then "saved" by you. Why are you so keen to back Doug up when his information doesn't match your own?

Because when I saved Doug it was said to be successful.